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by Syp, Level 43
Last updated at December 22, 2008, 10:08 am
When the borders between sanity and insanity come into view, it's time to take a break from whatever scary obsessive task you're performing -- you know, like endlessly grinding explosive snotlings for a backpack which NEVER DROPS FOR ME.

So /logout, followed by the near-unfamiliar character creation screen.  I've been tinkering around with the idea of trying out Destruction, y'know, just on the side, and after talking with Keen and Snafzg while making ChaosCast, I felt convicted to give the Squig Herder another go.  That was my #1 most desirable class I wanted to play when the game released, but circumstances threw me on Order's side, and there's no option for a goblin to defect to Sigmar's good graces.

I didn't really dive far into it, just messing around in the starter zones, but it definitely felt lonely.  A lot of that was due to the lack of a guild text scroll, which got me thinking about something I've been meaning to discuss.   What is WAR like for people who either choose to remain guildless or have yet to find a good guild?

Pre-launch, the mantra that Mythic kept throwing our way was that, to really get the most out of this game, we had to join a guild.  Guild's offered so many more options to the player -- claiming keeps, recall scrolls, heraldry, banners, etc. -- that it was silly not to at least associate yourself with some large gang just for the goodies, if not the social experience.  There were, of course, the features of a guild that come standard with every game, including a support system that is somewhat obligated to help out, company that's just a few key clicks away, and a group of people that share like-minded interests and goals.

For me, I simply cannot play a MMORPG guildless.  I really can't.  It kills any long-term residence in a game if I fail to find a group of folks that share my sense of humor and casual approach to play.  Even though I'm sometimes a pretty introverted person, I need people around, in real life and digital life.

What do guildless people -- who choose to stay that way -- get out of a game like this?  You'd have to be strongly motivated to play and advance your character with specific goals, I'd imagine.  Maybe you'd view the game much like you would a multiplayer Team Fortress map or something, where you're just in it for the action, but not the socialization.

On the other end of the spectrum are people who join guilds yet play solo 99% of the time.  People like this get belittled because they're obviously not getting the whole point of playing a MMO ("that's what the second 'M' stands for, duh!" is something you hear a lot), but I do understand why they do it.  These are people who don't really want to be grouped up all the time, yet they crave the social connection, turning a MMORPG into a single-player game with a multiplayer chat window.  That's still an important function of a guild, in my opinion, because the only -- the ONLY -- thing you will ever take away from these games in the long run are the relationships you build.  Nobody will care ten years from now what gear you get or what raids you farmed or how many Tome unlocks you finagled.  If anything, ten years from now, you might still be friends with the people that you met in these games and forged memories with.

So I can't see why you'd play without exploring that opportunity.  Do you play guildless?  I'd love to hear your perspective!
     
6 comments
JenoSidhe
JenoSidhe Dec 22, 2008 at 10:18 am
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what server did you roll destro on?

i personally have not played an MMO ever that i didnt have RL friends playing as well and we are always in a guild. i also could not imagine being guildless for very long simply because i cant stand people who seem to be dumb and usually a guild is a decent way to weed that out. I think back to WoW and what it would have been like if i only would have got to do PuG insta runs. i would have quit soon after getting 60 thats for sure. At this point i usually play an MMO until my RL friends dont and then its over.
Gauldar
Gauldar Dec 22, 2008 at 11:24 am
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I haven't found a guild yet that I can connect to yet in WAR.  Last guild I was in for WOW was a great one it was probably the 11th best guild on the server.  I don't care for playing WOW anymore, but the guild gave me a feeling a belonging non the less and it would be my only reason for going back to the game.  The current one I am in with WAR is feeling deserted, so I have had a lack of interest in logging onto WAR lately.  I have had a better experience with PUGs in WAR then I have in WOW, probably because gear distribution is random and there is less to fight over, or make mistakes with who got what. 
Xzandrate
Xzandrate Dec 22, 2008 at 4:22 pm
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Alot of times I fall into the solo play in the MMO, but not so much for want, as I guess guilt.  I try and jump in and squeeze what time I can, but alot of times I'll end up getting called away for something while I'm trying to play.  So for the most part, rather than a bunch of joining only to leave 5 minutes later, I often will grind stuff out solo a bit more often, or run in scenarios.  The big rolling warbands for ORvR have been nice too, can jump in, take a couple BOs or a keep and jump out and attend to whatever hassles RL has brought up.
 
 
foo
foo Dec 22, 2008 at 5:28 pm
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I used to be guilded in MMOs, but stopped that particular habit when I realized it was the single largest cause of most my gaming frustrations and disenjoyment. Now I find it amusing that some people assume an unguilded player is somehow a loner or antisocial, when that behavior is completely independent of whether or not you click 'accept' for a guild invitation. :)

By lacking a guild chat channel, I gain the freedom to play on my own schedule without the commitments (or guilt) of choosing to play for my own pleasure. It's only less social in the sense that I avoid most of the drama, politics and other irrelevancies to the game. To me the guild system in most MMOs is a convenience for the rest of us who would like all the inane chatter and personal drama to be restricted to private channels we don't have to see. This doesn't make me socially cut off from other players, I still interact with them by avatar and chat, share ideas, strategies, jokes and all-around good gaming fun. Most people who are fun and interesting to play with don't restrict their personalities to their guild chat! Warhammer is even more social than most MMOs I've played due to the RvR dynamics that encourage player cooperation, and I get more than enough personality interactions in the WB, Region and RVR chat channels.

What I realized after a few years in guilds was that I was avoiding playing the game or simply not enjoying it because I often felt my time was commited to guild events or other players. It's like going to an amusement park with a group of people with varying interests, if your primary purpose is to spend time with those people, it doesn't matter what rides or attractions you go to. But if your primary purpose is to enjoy the rides and attractions with good company it only works if you all want to do the same things, which rarely happens. So inevitably somebody (often me) finds themselves on the rides and attractions that are not their first choice, which over time sours the experience. Yet, by NOT going with a group, you can go to all the rides and attractions that are your first choice and enjoy the shared experience with the people who are there doing the same thing. More fun, less bitterness, same social interaction. And in WAR, regardless of whether or not they would be 'guildies' I spend time mostly with the same people because they are in the same tier and progressing at the same pace at the same times of day that I play.

All that said, I'm always looking to notice players who impress me or guilds that seem to have an above average number of good players who are interesting and fun. If I was to ever get an invitation to one of the few standouts I'd probably accept just to see if I like it. But I also suffer from an MMO version of Mark Twain's conjecture that I'd never join a guild that would accept me as a member, so it's just as well that the opportunity has never presented itself. :)
Artsi
Artsi Dec 23, 2008 at 4:09 am
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So far, I've been strictly guildless in WAR (I don't count the guild we started with RL friends, most of whom went back to WoW after two months, and that guild was just a feature rich chat channel for us anyway; remember when the game didn't remember your last chat channel?).

Just after the launch guild didn't matter much. There were lots of players doing everything, so one could easily do stuff in open groups. Since then the server population went down to the point where it became a free character transfer source.

I didn't need a guild for playing all six tier1 paths to see how they are and how the careers feel. I didn't need a guild for running scenarios or doing normal PVE quests. But pretty soon there were no more open groups for PVE stuff nor RvR, so PQ stage 1 grind was the only option for getting the influence. RvR battlefield objectives and keeps have been a rare treat, and I haven't seen any of the dungeons at all. Recently, I have not been able to persuade people to do the Keg End event quest for killing massive ogres (the heros in RvR areas). So, basically, I am now completely limited to solo content and the stuff that gets automatically populated (scenarios) or RvR areas where everybody else is playing (thanks to the recent RvR influence epic rewards luring people).
We never got our small IRL friends guild past rank 7, so I didn't see any really nice benefits from having a highly ranked guild, either.

During this time, I have not had any proper tools for finding decent guilds to join to. I have gotten several random guild invites without any prior contact, and I categorically deny such invites, as I don't much care for such guilds (that don't care who they invite). Yet, as has been stated in previous comments, one either needs a mass guild that has enough players for every tier, every scenario, every PQ and every keep and dungeon, or one has to keep up with the rest of the guild and do the stuff that the others are doing. Neither one is particularly tempting to me.

Currently, WAR simply does not have the player base to support all the group activities that it offers. Those, who are fortunate enough to be in a guild that can support their members, have a chance to see all the best the game has to offer. The rest of us are mostly seeing the worse side (solo PVE content that is very much lacking).

I would very much like to play this game as a team game, but not having found a decent guild to enjoy it with, I'm only seeing selfish epic hunters. I've pretty much given up this game, as it seems that I can't find fun people to play with, and the developers simply do not seem to understand the concept of fun nor do they seem to understand how different game features and mechanics fit into the bigger picture (example: they want more RvR action, yet they don't provide much information about where it is, and travel to action is cumbersome, and how did they change travel? They made it more expensive. And all three live events have been merely frustrating).

And to those who might wonder: I played a holy priest in WoW (up to healing heroics in TBC) and though I wanted to avoid healers in WAR, my highest alt is a R20 rune priest. I just like support roles, I guess. But just as with WoW, I'm growing tired of the crap that one inevitably gets when healing PUGs. I don't see things changing, and I don't like how things stand these days (for me).
BVD
BVD Dec 23, 2008 at 9:16 am
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With 14 toons in total, I've been doing a lot of solo'ing.
My highest toon, a low-20's Chosen, did accept a guild invite to a guild that has like 200+ members, but I'll be quitting that guild the next time I log on.  I'm just not a fan of Zerg Guilds that aren't cohesive or have some defining purpose / goal.

So far, I've found I prefer "single serving" friends & acquaintances in WAR.
Meet up in the oRvR lakes, do your thing for an hour or two, and then say your goodbyes.  You can get a laugh or two if you have a strange sense of humour (I suspect Syp, you do), but they don't have to end up being the people you level with to Endgame.

That being said, if someone "clicks" with my sense of humour, or seems to have a fairly accomodating approach to WAR but doesn't stand for stupidity (that pretty much sums me up as a MMO player), I'll add them to my friends list and keep an eye out for them online. 
However, now that I have 14 toons this really doesn't work well as well as it used to when I only had 3.  By the time I get back to playing a toon, it's probably been a week or so and the person who I befriended is 5 - 10 levels ahead of me.

I guess what I need is a guild of about 10 - 15 people tops, who are all Altaholics :)
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